How the Government Shutdown Is Messing Up Texas

Categories: Politics

tedcruzwave.jpg
Gage Skidmore
To the political novice, a federal government shutdown sounds like an excuse to get crazy. Anarchy in the streets! Do more than the usual drugs in Deep Ellum! Operate a bandit taxi service from the same 1993 minivan you use to transport DISD students to school! But that's not how it really works. In fact, the federal government shutdown is putting a stop to a lot of fun things in Dallas, and is making life unpleasant for many people across Texas. Here are some of the things we can't do as our legislators continue to make asses out of themselves.

Watch reserve officers-in-training run to Dallas while holding a football and asking you for money
For the past 30 years, the Red River Shootout has been accompanied by a charity "Run to Dallas," in which the University of Texas' NROTC Battalion runs 200 miles from the campus to Dallas. As part of the event, the ROTC tries to encourage the public to donate to charities such as the T.J. Ford Foundation and the American Red Cross . But the charity run won't happen this year, because it's been deemed non-essential.

Receive food donations from the USDA
The North Texas Food Bank has stopped receiving shipments from the United States Department of Agriculture during the government shutdown.WFAA reports that 10 truckloads of food for the charity have been canceled, forcing the food bank to skimp out on as many as 305,000 new meals. Food banks are asking for donations from the public to combat the shortage.

Drink beer that tastes like pumpkin and other weird fall flavors
If you're one of those sophisticated drunks who goes out not to get laid but just to analyze the hoppiness of new craft beer, then your evening out at the local brewery will be even sadder and more sterile than usual. That's because craft brewers can't introduce new beer flavors during the shutdown, as the Alcohol and Tobacco Tax and Trade Bureau has stopped approving new recipes.

The Four Corners Brewing Co. in West Dallas told The Dallas Morning News that getting approval for its winter seasonal beer will "probably be delayed for longer than normal," while Community Beer Co. in the Design District can't even figure out which of its flavors are currently approved thanks to the janky TTB website.

New breweries are also unable to open, putting a hold on local pending projects such as the Collective Brewing Project in Fort Worth.

However, current permit-holders are still good to go. In that case, we suggest you borrow some gingerbread-flavored high fructose corn syrup from Starbucks and squirt it into whatever craft beer you're currently sipping so the flavor isn't so grossly out of season.

Calculate your likelihood of catching the flu from eating that stranger's perfectly good Schlotsky's sandwich that he only ate half of and then just left there
KERA reports that the Centers for Disease Control's flu-tracking program is on hold because of the shutdown, so there's no way to figure out how bad the flu season is. Dallas health officials are warning everyone to get the flu shot. "We can't determine where the trends are in terms of flu cases throughout the United Sates," Dallas County Health Department Zach Thompson told the station.

Eat Foster Farms chicken in peace
Notice how there's a lot of food and beverage-related items on this list? That's because federal food safety workers have been furloughed during the shutdown. However, major food corporations got to stay open and keep on producing. Their break from pesky government regulators seemed to be going well, until five Texans got sick in a national salmonella outbreak that has sickened more than 300 people since July.

The CDC can't pin down the cause of the Texas illnesses yet, but the national outbreak has been linked to Foster Farms chicken.

Foster Farms' response? On Wednesday, a Foster Farms spokesman told the News that the chicken is safe to eat when it's "properly cooked and handled," a statement that does not impress the Center for Science in the Public Interest and other consumer advocacy organizations. In fact, Consumer Reports conducted its own test and announced today that it found a dangerous strain of Salmonella in a sample of Foster Farms raw chicken. The group says it's "outrageous" that Foster Farms has yet to issue a recall.

Go camping in Fort Worth
The U.S. Army Corps of Engineers' Fort Worth district announced that all corps-operated campgrounds and parks will be closed during the shutdown, just as the weather is getting nice.


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71 comments
Ashley192361984
Ashley192361984

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mavdog
mavdog topcommenter

RT, this poll is right up your alley...

Amid the government shutdown, 60% of Americans say the Democratic and Republicans parties do such a poor job of representing the American people that a third major party is needed. That is the highest Gallup has measured in the 10-year history of this question. A new low of 26% believe the two major parties adequately represent Americans.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/165392/perceived-need-third-party-reaches-new-high.aspx

harleykarmadad
harleykarmadad

It is sad that so many Texan's have become accustomed to someone like Cruz making a complete fool out of our State.   I guess we have got so use to the rest of America laughing at us and thinking we are a bunch if ignorant hicks that we just let it slide.   I know I do.  I gave up years ago in the Tom Delay days.

Yet, I do think Cruz takes the Whako cake.  And I am somewhat pleased that not every local publication is attempting to make a mega hero out of him. 

roo_ster
roo_ster

Is that the best the DO can do?

becoolerifyoudid
becoolerifyoudid

Anyone still suffering under the Sequester?  I mean it has been about 6 months.

mavdog
mavdog topcommenter

maybe the headline should read "How the government shutdown is messing up the GOP"

The Republican Party has been badly damaged in the ongoing government shutdown and debt limit standoff, with a new NBC News/Wall Street Journal poll finding that a majority of Americans blame the GOP for the shutdown, and with the party’s popularity declining to its lowest level.

Just 24 percent of respondents have a favorable opinion about the GOP, and only 21 percent have a favorable view of the Tea Party, which are both at all-time lows in the history of poll.

Well done Ted Cruz! Your political acumen has been proven to be as empty as your suit....

http://firstread.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/10/10/20903624-nbcwsj-poll-shutdown-debate-damages-gop?lite

Sotiredofitall
Sotiredofitall topcommenter

Big Bend National Park is also currently closed - but going anyway  "One possible silver lining to the partial shutdown of the federal government: The closure of Big Bend National Park has created a welcome influx of visitors at Big Bend Ranch State Park."

Myrna.Minkoff-Katz
Myrna.Minkoff-Katz topcommenter

He can do one thing well.  With that Nazi salute he could play Hitler.

ruddski
ruddski

I've been luckily unaffected by Obama's punishments, but I've found that the shutdown is cutting Into Michelle Obama's tweets!! Now I'm ready to string up the first Republican voter I can coax out of hiding.

holmantx
holmantx topcommenter

Only 17% of the federal government is shut down.  83% of the government CANNOT be shut down unless it loses its ability to borrow.  And of that 17%, it appears this administration is cherry-picking those functions which cause the most torment to the citizen in order to modify our behavior.

You would think this would inflame and motivate an alternative news and opinion rag such as the Dallas Observer.

So Ms. Silverstein, let me lay it out for you real simple.

I can work and get paid.

I can work and NOT get paid.

or, I can NOT work and NOT get paid.

If I don't get no. 1 I want no. 3.

and if you don't understand what I am talking about, then turn in your pencil.

Our government is employing the whip hand, and everyone should object to that.

RTGolden1
RTGolden1 topcommenter

@mavdog There is no need for a third party, there is a need for Americans to wake the hell up and realize there are legitimate third parties out there.  Yes there are hurdles, but there are also hurdles to the Dems and Repubs (they get a pass on them.  Neither major party has gotten their paperwork to get their name on the ballots turned in on time in TX for the last 3 or 4 elections).

I agree with Kdub on the need to reform the system. Term limits being a top priority.  I think elected federal service should be limited to 12 years, total (16 or 20 if elected President after serving in Congress)  After serving in Congress, members should be barred, for 20 years, from working for any kind of lobby or Federal contractor.

kduble
kduble

@mavdog That may be, but it won't happen until we reform the system:

* The lack of term limits permits politicians to become increasingly entrenched with each passing election.

* The unlimited ability to purchase advertising deters challengers.

* The lack of contribution limits allow special interests to mortgage politicians.

* Partisan drawing of districts further reinforces incumbency.

* The two-party duopoly has used its influence in state legislatures to erect hurdles to keep competing parties off the ballot, and finally, a big one

* At the presidential level, the Electoral College deters minor parties. Due to the lack of a runoff, supporting a Libertarian tends to help the Democrats, and supporting a Green tends to help Republicans. The Green Party vote for Nader surpassed Bush's margin of victory in both New Hampshire and Florida. Had Gore won New Hampshire, he could have won without Florida.

CitzenKim
CitzenKim

@harleykarmadad Based on who we elect on the State and National level, one can only conclude that yes, the majority of us ARE ignorant hicks, sorry to say.

MissMacy
MissMacy

@becoolerifyoudid People are DEFINITELY suffering from the sequester, but probably not anybody you know because the cuts are particularly painful to the poor and disadvantaged. But you'll notice that the 1% haven't had to give up ANYTHING.

kduble
kduble

@mavdog  If the House thinks the government spends too much, then it can go to conference with the Senate and negotiate lower spending. It needn't shut down the government.


Here's the real story: House Republicans want to rail against government spending and borrowing in the abstract, which is a politically popular stance, but they don't want to take the heat for actually reducing it. Most of the things the government does enjoy popular support, so cutting programs invites backlash.

dingo
dingo

@mavdog From the same survey:

The federal debt ceiling limits the amount of money the government can borrow. When the U.S. Treasury needs to issue debt above the ceiling in order to avoid going into bankruptcy and to pay the government’s bills, Congress needs to vote to raise the ceiling. Which of the following causes you more concern? 

That Congress will not raise the debt ceiling and the federal government will not pay its bills, such as defaulting on its loans and not making payments to Social Security recipients and government workers ............... 37 

That Congress will raise the debt ceiling and that federal spending will increase and the government will go further into debt as a result ............... 41 

Or do you not know enough about this to have an opinion at this time ...........19 

Not sure ........................................................................................................... 3 

How do you square the low GOP rating with the above survey result indicating that GOP actions are more in line with the largest concern related to federal debt. (according to your survey)? 

It seems that a significant percentage of the population is confused as to who is what. A democracy can only function properly when its citizens follow through on their responsibilities to remain informed.

BTW, the survey's 36% 'Democrats in Congress' approval rating and an AP survey's Obama 37% approval rating from two days ago are probably also relevant to this discussion.

becoolerifyoudid
becoolerifyoudid

@mavdog None of the Repubs in the middle of this are elected nationally.  It would be more relevant to see how they are viewed by registered voters in their respective districts.  Being unpopular in areas where you were unpopular before isn't news.

Sotiredofitall
Sotiredofitall topcommenter

@Myrna.Minkoff-Katz High School debate rule: First person to reference Hitler loses

Myrna.Minkoff-Katz
Myrna.Minkoff-Katz topcommenter

@ruddski If you're a republican, you have been affected by the shutdown:

"The Republican Party has been badly damaged in the ongoing government shutdown and debt limit standoff, with a new NBC News/Wall Street Journal poll finding that a majority of Americans blame the GOP for the shutdown, and with the party’s popularity declining to its lowest level.

By a 22-point margin (53 percent to 31 percent), the public blames the Republican Party more for the shutdown than President Barack Obama – a wider margin of blame for the GOP than the party received during the poll during the last shutdown in 1995-96."

Myrna.Minkoff-Katz
Myrna.Minkoff-Katz topcommenter

@holmantx You're forgetting the small businesses that are badly affected by federal employees who have been furloughed, not to mention the biggies, like Lockheed.

ruddski
ruddski

collective punishment, but Obama's favorite golf course is being kept open. Earlier, the Obama machine asked democrats to seek and identify neighbors and acquaintances they suspected of republucanism, so that they could be "educated". Maybe good democrats can now use the info they gathered

mavdog
mavdog topcommenter

@dingo

How do you square the low GOP rating with the above survey result indicating that GOP actions are more in line with the largest concern related to federal debt. (according to your survey)?

that's easy. the GOP has not linked their position re: government shutdown or the issue of the debt limit to a reduction in federal spending or a proposal to address the federal deficit. they have linked their position to the defunding of the ACA.

so yes, the citizens are informed. they do not like what they are hearing from the GOP.

mavdog
mavdog topcommenter

@becoolerifyoudid 

interesting attempt to spin. as long as you feel better about the results guess it could be deemed successful.

holmantx
holmantx topcommenter

@bvckvs

It went right past you.

People will not labor if they do not receive the benefits of that labor.  It is called the Law of Self-Interest.  I am referring to the private sector.

When the benefits of labor is intercepted in increasing increments by an increasingly redistributive government, Americans will decrease their labor.

Obamacare on top of all the other social programs, and in the face of ever increasing deficits and debt the taxpayer will be burdened with, the taxpayer will have no choice but to evade such oppressive taxation.

Socialism has never worked for this reason.

We should have been out of this recession four years ago.

holmantx
holmantx topcommenter

@bvckvs 

It went right past you.

People will not labor if they do not receive the benefits of that labor.  It is called the Law of Self-Interest.  I am referring to the private sector.

When the benefits of labor is intercepted in increasing increments by an increasingly redistributive government, Americans will decrease their labor.

Obamacare on top of all the other social programs, and in the face of ever increasing deficits and debt the taxpayer will be burdened with, the taxpayer will have no choice but to evade such oppressive taxation.

Socialism has never worked for this reason.

We should have been out of this recession four years ago.


holmantx
holmantx topcommenter

@Myrna.Minkoff-Katz @holmantx 

Think about what you just said.  The private sector, and small business in particular, is caught in a looping economic ground hog day because government is so large it is consuming too much of the M1 oxygen.  

The federal government has been and continues to force banks to buy its debt, leaving very little to be lent back out into the private sector (to small business).  

And it's STILL not enough.  They are printing money out of thin air and buying $85 BILLION a month . . . to buy their own debt!

We're out of money girl friend.

And the working side of the house is beginning to lay down at the yoke.  The wagon is too heavy and no application of the whip hand by a brutally oppressive government will make that mule get up.

We are re-distributing waaaay too much money and people just aren't going to comply.

What's next?  Send in the hard men with guns to collect?

I think they are on our side.

holmantx
holmantx topcommenter

@ruddski

we need re-education camps.

The San Francisco Cable cars are the only mobile National Monuments.  How odd they haven't been shut down.  Wonder why.

Even if they were actually profitable, which they are not.  Of course, we must continue to operate mass transit at a loss.

"I can't be broke!  I still have checks." (old Blonde joke).

we are all blondes now . . .

mavdog
mavdog topcommenter

@dingo

You are reacting in a simplistic manner to a very complicated issue.

I, and you, don't have an answer. national security vs freedom of the press. that's the story.

is snowden a hero or a tool of our adversaries? are reporters obligated to treat confidential information affecting national security as just that, confidential? does government have the right to know where and how reporters obtain classified info?

how you view these questions determines if you agree with greeenwald and the comm to protect journalists.

instantaneous news. when someone can broadcast in a nanosecond and reach the entire world, the issues have greater impact.

is obama the worst pres on free speech and press, or is he just the first who has to deal with the new dynamic? even looking at the facts, tough to answer.

dingo
dingo

@bvckvs @RTGolden1 @mavdog"The Reason"? Its pretty damn absurd of you to pin all corruption on the right given this recent scathing report:

"Obama's anti-press measures 'are the most aggressive I've seen since the Nixon administration'"

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/oct/10/cpi-report-press-freedoms-obama

The report  even includes quotes from left leaning NY Times and Washington Post reporters commenting on the severity of the Obama administration's crackdown on a free press.

Your garden variety misinformation has become, yet again, tiresome.



RTGolden1
RTGolden1 topcommenter

@dingo @mavdog I'll correct this for you:  The GOP has been the party pushing for cuts in social program spending and making noise about deficit reduction for years.

The GOP is no more serious about reducing the deficit than the Dems are.  They just have a different idea about where deficit spending should be directed.

mavdog
mavdog topcommenter

@dingo

come on dude, you can't say with a straight face this government shutdown was NOT explicitly linked to the ACA.

It was, from Cruz's grandstanding 21 hour soliloquy to Boehner's caving in to the tea party caucus and inserting the defunding of the ACA into the House funding bill (which btw did NOT have ANY deficit reduction language...)

seriously. the GOP lost sight of making deficit reduction the focus, and now Boehner is trying to get it back. unfortunatelky for him there's folks like Cruz who keep distracting the focus.

dingo
dingo

@mavdog @dingoWhere did I say that the ACA was not linked? My point was squarely with the deficit. The GOP has been the party pushing for deficit reduction  (years previous to 'last Sunday' if you are in fact really that dimwitted) along with ACA repeal.  They are both related in the minds of a significant number of Americans. You are attempting to outmaneuver the facts I have presented from your survey.

CogitoErgoSum
CogitoErgoSum

@dingoThat's simply damage control. The original reason for the shutdown was to derail Obamacare. Don't even try to deny it. Ted Cruz said as much, and we all know his gang owns Boehner's ass.

mavdog
mavdog topcommenter

@dingo 

not fiction in the least. if you say there hasn't been linkage with ACA, you're not being honest.

Boehner reads the polls, too. That quote's from Sunday.....

dingo
dingo

@mavdog @dingo  

>that's easy. the GOP has not linked their position re: government shutdown or the issue of the debt limit to a reduction in federal spending or a proposal to address the federal deficit. 

 Its easy because its fiction:

"Boehner said Sunday on ABC's "This Week" he won't bring up bills to reopen the government or raise the debt ceiling unless Democrats agree to trim the deficit."



RTGolden1
RTGolden1 topcommenter

@mavdog @dingo Apparently, not many more of them like what they are hearing from the Democrats and the Administration either.  Finally, just maybe, Americans might be waking up to the fact that our two dominant political parties are really not that different from each other.  Both parties have been doing their best to destroy this country for decades now.  I don't know if their slow progress in this endeavor says a lot about the strength of American democracy or the ineptitude of American politicians.

CogitoErgoSum
CogitoErgoSum

@CitzenKim Seems, though, that this popular backlash against Repubs and TPs has hit the moderate Republican electorate. Sure the die-hard GOP voters will still vote Republican in 2016, but the question is whether this shutdown will come back to haunt Cruz in the primary, or even prevent him from running. I hope it does. Then again, maybe I hope it doesn't - might increase the likelihood of a Dem win in the general election if Cruz is the nominee.

CitzenKim
CitzenKim

@mavdog @becoolerifyoudid Sorry but I disagree.  As bciyd referenced, their own district is the primary consideration (particularly for HOR members).  if their primary concern is their own political success (and I think this is true of most of them), all that matters is their own district.  A moderate Republican congressman from Texas or most of the red state US is much more threatened by Tea Party in their own district than they are by 100's of millions outside of it.

mavdog
mavdog topcommenter

@becoolerifyoudid

this fiasco is harming the GOP brand. that will affect political races across the country.

the more local the election the less impact the damage will be. If a voter can identify with the candidate the person rather than the candidate of the party, the more likely the brand's damage won't have a negative impact.

dsmithy3211
dsmithy3211

@becoolerifyoudid @mavdog Exactly right. Even considering Cruz's future presidential ambitions, his opinion polls in states like California and New York matter not one iota. What matters to Cruz is his opinion poll in Texas (to be reelected as a senator) and in key swing states (in case he ever decides to run for POTUS). Everything else is just noise.

becoolerifyoudid
becoolerifyoudid

@mavdog @becoolerifyoudid I rarely vote for anyone associated with the two major parties, so I don't have a dog in the fight of who is "winning".  I just think a lot of the Repubs that are behind this know that while they may be unpopular nationally, it is whether they are still getting approval by the people that elected them that matters. 

The poll cited doesn't shed any light on whether they are still getting approval by the people that vote in their districts.

holmantx
holmantx topcommenter

@bvckvs

In 1984, about thirty years ago, Public Debt was $1.8 Trillion and it scared the shit outa everybody.  So much so our politicians actually got together and passed the DEFICIT REDUCTION ACT OF 1984

Well, that fell apart so they enacted the Emergency Deficit Control Act of 1985, the Budget Enforcement Act of 1990, the Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act of 1993, the Deficit Reduction Act of 2005, and the Budget Control Act of 2011

We now owe $17.2 Trillion and the only argument today is . . . at what rate of increase should we borrow just to pay the interest on what we've been borrowing.  We are now running trillion=plus annual deficits, and are projected to continue to do so though the end of this decade. 

You mentioned Social Security.  I like Social Security.  Social Security is gone.  Congress drained it dry and it is now stuffed with IOUs.  Those IOUs are already being presented to Treasury for cash in.  We now borrow so fast it’s a blur. 

For the past thirty years we have been borrowing to pay for stuff we wanted instead of collecting it in taxation.  

The Yuppies are retiring in mass.  Their income years are about over with. Our tax system is based on income.  They are the fastest demographic climbing into the Public Wagon.  

They are not going to help pay this back.  They are not even going to help decelerate the rate of growth in debt.  This is wildly out of control.  They are now demanding their fair share of the borrowing. 

This leaves such a staggering sum to be collected, just to arrest the borrowing rate, much less try and stabilize and begin paying it down, the generations behind the Yuppies are not going to do it. 

Understand what I am saying?  They ain’t gonna do it.  And I don’t blame them.  They didn’t create this monster. 

Because this mile high debt wall rolling toward them is nothing more than a MASSIVE claim on their future labor.  It is such a giant demand, they will not perform that labor in the first place.  Or at least where it can be taxed to the extent it has to be. 

These politicians will not be here to pay this down or back.  Hell, they can't even slow the rate of increase.  

If you notice, the only argument now is how we are going to lift the cap in order to borrow even faster.  There is no other option being discussed because there IS no other option. 

And based upon your picture, you are going to be lucky the generations behind you do not hunt you down and gut you. 

I suggest you leave the country while you can.  

holmantx
holmantx topcommenter

@mavdog @holmantx @RTGolden1 

I did. Your retort is for your crowd, I suppose.  So smirk and pirouette, for the crowd.

Meanwhile Rome burns.

mavdog
mavdog topcommenter

@holmantx @mavdog @RTGolden1

so where is the explanation of hollow claim "the federal government is forcing banks to buy it's debt"??

the false statement that the feds are "leaving very little to be lent back out into the private sector (to small business)."?? 

the simple minded comment "we're out of money"??

the written post is hard to deny. it is interesting to watch your attempt to dance around it tho.

holmantx
holmantx topcommenter

@mavdog @RTGolden1

Since August 2008, the Fed has tripled the monetary base from about $0.8 trillion to $2.7 trillion. More than half of this new money was used to purchase U.S. government bonds (Treasury debt). http://research.stlouisfed.org/publications/es/article/9644

Banks Use $1.77 Trillion to Double Treasury Purchases - Bloomberg

Forget too big to fail: Some banks now too small to succeed - Los ...
I'm in the biz.  This is common knowledge and widely written about.
You really ARE out in the tall grass on this one.

mavdog
mavdog topcommenter

@RTGolden1 

odd you would get the idea that holman was putting forth the idea that "plenty of money might be the problem" when he states there isn't money to lend to small business, they're "consuming too much of the M1 oxygen" and "we're out of money" way too much credit imho.

the issue of the Fed and "QE" is not an easy answer. while I tend to be a monetarist and see the use of the printing presses for increasing the money supply (M2) as problematic, one cannot argue that Bernanke has done a stellar job addressing the recession/collapse in 08 and steering our financial system into a healthier situation today.

the policies haven't decreased the value of the $ because it is still viewed as the most stable and least risky currency in the world. while we may have problems, they are much worse elsewhere.

the trick is turning off the QE, reducing M2, and not triggering a downturn. Yellen has a tough road to navigate over the next couple of years.

RTGolden1
RTGolden1 topcommenter

@mavdog @holmantx I think holman was hinting that the 'plenty of money' might BE the problem.  From what I understand of the situation, the Treasury is printing the worth right out of the Dollar.  So while there might be billions of dollars out there, there's not billions in value attached to them.

mavdog
mavdog topcommenter

@holmantx 

M1 has increased approx. 10% year over year as of August. M1 by definition excludes any monies held by the government, inc. the Fed. if there's anything economists are concerned about is too much M1 "oxygen".

How is the "federal government forc[ing] banks to buy its debt"????

private sector lending and specifically small business lending has been fairly static at just under $600B for the past couple of years. small businesses are getting loans and banks are willing to make business loans.

http://www.sba.gov/sites/default/files/files/SBL_2013Q1(1).pdf

there's plenty of money. money isn't the problem.

mavdog
mavdog topcommenter

@holmantx 

I'd have a positive cash flow too if I had no debt

not if you didn't have sufficient revenues to cover the base expenses. not much of a financial whiz are you?

you made the statement "even if they were actually profitable, which they are not". you are wrong. their revenue exceeded their expenses.

your attempt to shift the subject of your ridiculous question of "why" the San Francisco cable cars still are running won't work.

stupid is as stupid does. keep up the good work!

holmantx
holmantx topcommenter

@mavdog @holmantx @ruddski 

I'd have a positive cash flow too if I had no debt,

or could rely upon the taxpayer to pay it.  No doubt that is why you carefully worded it (positive cash flow).  You did not say it was profitable, in the black, could stand alone.

And DART is not a national monument.  And how was/is it funded and who helps service its bond debt?

the federal and local taxpayer, of course.

could it stand on its own two feet (revenues in excess of expenses and debt service to build it).

Of course not.

but you are a blonde dog.

mavdog
mavdog topcommenter

@holmantx @ruddski

The San Francisco Cable cars are the only mobile National Monuments. How odd they haven't been shut down. Wonder why.

gee, DART is still operating, too. wonder why they "haven't been shut down"? and all those other local and state workers?

oh, could it be the fact they aren't federal agencies/programs???

how daft. and you infer blondes aren't smart...

btw SFMTA, operator of the cable cars, had a positive cash flow in 2012.

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