Boy Scouts Kick the Can, Delay Decision on Gay Ban Until May

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America, it seems, was waiting with bated breath this morning as the Boy Scouts of America board of directors, meeting in Irving, was expected to vote on ending its longstanding ban on gays.

America will have to keep waiting. The organization announced this morning that the board has decided to delay the vote until May.

"After careful consideration and extensive dialogue within the Scouting family, along with comments from those outside the organization, the volunteer officers of the Boy Scouts of America's National Executive Board concluded that due to the complexity of this issue, the organization needs time for a more deliberate review of its membership policy," the group said in a statement this morning.

To "further engage representatives of Scouting's membership and listen to their perspectives and concerns," the organization will pass the buck to the 1,400 voting members of its national council. They won't meet until May.


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25 comments
Anon
Anon

A lot of people like to make the argument, "If you don't like gay marriage, don't get gay married." Using this logic, I've got another one. If you don't like the BSA, don't join the BSA.

TheCredibleHulk
TheCredibleHulk topcommenter

Next thing you know we'll have pink Pinewood Derby cars.

RTGolden1
RTGolden1 topcommenter

"" To "further engage representatives of Scouting's membership and listen to their perspectives and concerns," the organization will pass the buck to the 1,400 voting members of its national council. They won't meet until May.""

Pass the buck?  Or democracy in action?  I don't have a dog in this hunt, don't give one whit about the BSA and their policies.  Your own motivations are revealed in this line, however.  If democracy doesn't do what you want, by god, let's just decree it from on high!!  Now the BSA doesn't have to put it to a vote of the general membership, they're not a government.  As such, they also don't have to change the existing policy.  Whether they should or shouldn't is a matter of personal opinion, of which we've seen many expressed over the last couple of weeks.

It would seem to me that the BSA, a private organization, has decided to let it's members decide for themselves if they want this policy changed, and they plan to pursue this in a democratic fashion.  What could be wrong with that?

Myrna.Minkoff-Katz
Myrna.Minkoff-Katz topcommenter

It's not hard to understand the homophobia of the BSA, seeing as how the vast majority of its members are Mormons and Catholics, two of the most strident gay-hating organizations there are.  The same ignorant fools that are trying to keep gays out of the BSA are the same fools that insisted gays would ruin the military.

briannesbitt
briannesbitt

"the executives of the BSA have decided to make this a "bottom up" rather than "top down" decision for the future of the organization."

Bottom up and top down huh? Nice choice of words....

jermjerm
jermjerm

Trustworthy, loyal, helpful, friendly, courteous, kind, obedient, cheerful, thrifty, brave, clean and reverent. I don't see where hateful and discriminatory fit in.

ThePosterFormerlyKnownasPaul
ThePosterFormerlyKnownasPaul topcommenter

Eric:  This is a tough problem for any organization.  According to the press release, it sounds as if the general membership has their own ideas concerning this potential policy change.


Give them a break and let them think this through.  Your snarky write up doesn't help the discussion much.


In the end this is a private organization.  It does have the right to determine who can be a member.  Those who provide funding to this organization do have the right to decide whether or not this policy will affect their decision to continue funding the BSA.


Could this be a situation where a group is willing to stick with their beliefs and and forgo the money?


It also seems as though the executives of the BSA have decided to make this a "bottom up" rather than "top down" decision for the future of the organization.

unclescrappy
unclescrappy

I guess the next thing will be SEX ORGIES during overnight campouts & such.

Boy Scouts were founded by Robert Baden Powell. with certain virtues & traits to make young men better citizens & men. It was NOT started by any Government & should not be subject to governmental control or influence. If you dont like the values, then go start the Queer Scouts or something. We promise us normal people wont try to join you & your organization. So Leave OURS Alone !!!!!

DMZ3
DMZ3

@Anon For sure. But I think that's why the BSA have been considering changing the policy to be more inclusive, to put it nicely. Because people *aren't* joining the BSA.

mavdog
mavdog topcommenter

nothing wrong with the decision, in fact letting the membership decide the issue was how the board was framing how it will be resolved. they were saying let the local groups decide.

ThePosterFormerlyKnownasPaul
ThePosterFormerlyKnownasPaul topcommenter

@Myrna.Minkoff-Katz Myrna, sometimes it is best to keep your mouth shut and let people think that you are an idiot than to open it and remove all doubt.


Your comment here is really no different from your politically polar opposites and expresses the same bigoted attitude that you profess to eschew.

RTGolden1
RTGolden1 topcommenter

@mavdog Right, I agree with you.  The article, however, frames it such that letting the membership decide the issue through a vote is somehow shirking responsibility, or kicking the can down the road.

DMZ3
DMZ3

@scottindallas @Myrna.Minkoff-Katz  Since this was mentioned, I decided to fact-check it. Here's the BSA's official figures: 

www.scouting.org/scoutsource/sitecore/content/scouting/about/factsheets/operating_orgs.aspx

Only 16 percent of Scouts are Mormon, but account for about one-third of scouting units (important distinction). I'm assuming this is because Mormon scouting units are smaller. Catholics make up 11 percent of all scouts and 8 percent of scouting units. So, in total, Catholics and Mormons make up 27 percent of all scouts, and less than a majority of scouting units. It's certainly not a vast majority. It is a majority, however, when stacked up against other "faith-based" units. But not all scouting units are faith-based.

Also: The second-largest group are Methodists, at 14 percent. Not Catholics. They're comparatively moderate and inclusive. But there's also a lot of Baptists and other religious groups - that if you include them - do make up a vast majority, so Myrna's point isn't totally off-base.

markzero
markzero

@mavdog @RTGolden1 Can you imagine them leaving it up to local troops whether to allow kids of different races or religions in? (Oh, wait, they aren't letting atheist kids in, and probably don't like Buddhists, etc., either.)

mavdog
mavdog topcommenter

@RTGolden1 

in all honesty it is both, they chose to not make a decision today that (reportedly) would allow the local group to decide if they wish to allow for gay leaders/members. To not make that decision is "kicking the can" as it were.

but, by deciding to not make a decision yet at the same time sending it to a vote by the membership is the democratic way to arrive with an answer to the issue.

I'd say the board knows very well how to finess the situation, and I mean that as a compliment.

roo_ster
roo_ster

@mavdogWhy sure!

The thesis is:
Homosexual males sexually abuse minors at much greater rates than heterosexual men.  (And thus are a greater danger to scouts than are heterosexual men.)

To get to that conclusion takes some simple math.

* Males commit from 96-99% of the sexual abuse of minors.

* Roughly 1/3 or 33% of the victims of such abuse are males, 64% are females.

* Homosexual men make up from 1-3% of the population, heterosexual men 49%-47%.

The rate of homosexual male sexual abuse of minors is roughly 9X that of heterosexual male sexual abuse of minors, when the proportion of homosexual and heterosexual men is taken into account.


Sources:
http://www.unh.edu/ccrc/pdf/CV171.pdf
[Shows female offenders being 5.4%, rather then the 1-4% of a lot of other studies, and smooshes some data together ("Any female victim in incident" vs "Female victim") but it has a LOT of other interesting information, especially about sexual abusers who are juveniles themselves.  Good qunatitative data & charts.]

http://www.unh.edu/ccrc/factsheet/pdf/CSA-FS20.pdf
[Kind of a bullet-point factoid survey.]

http://www.jimhopper.com/pdfs/Holmes_Offen_Waller_1997.pdf

http://williamsinstitute.law.ucla.edu/wp-content/uploads/Gates-How-Many-People-LGBT-Apr-2011.pdf

http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/pdf/10.1080/00926238408405945
[Interesting in that it looks at part of this issue over time.]
 

You can plug in any particular number from most any source and the conclusion still is "Homosexual men sexually abuse minors at a far greater rate then heterosexual men." 

Last, most/many sources declare that boys are much less likely than girls to report sexual abuse.

mavdog
mavdog topcommenter

@roo_ster

why don't you share with us the study that supports your claim of a "9:1 homosexual:heterosexual" ratio? or did you make this up yourself?

every academic study I have ever read contradicts your claim.

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