Greenville Ave. Clubs Sue to Stay Open After Midnight. But 7-Eleven Will Turn Out Lights.

Courtesy Avi Adelman
If you need a pack of smokes from this 7-Eleven after midnight tonight or in the near future, you're outta luck.
Once more, we return to Lowest Greenville Avenue, which tonight will see cops and code out in force to enforce the planned development district ordinance that officially kicks in at one second after midnight. Which, of course, you already knew.

Since last we addressed this issue this morning, there have been a few development, chief among them: Service Bar and Yucatan, which were denied their specific use permits allowing them to remain open past midnight, filed suit against the city today and requested a temporary restraining order that would allow them to remain open till 2 a.m. I'm trying to get a copy of the suit now, but several sources say a judge did grant the request till a hearing scheduled for October 7, otherwise known as Kol Nidre.

That means Service Bar and Yucatan will stay open. But the 7-Eleven down there will not.

"We're doing everything we can to get an SUP," corporate spokesperson Margaret Chabris tells Unfair Park this evening. "But we are closing at midnight." Far as she can tell, this is the first time the company, which was founded in Dallas in 1927 and went 24/7 in the early '60s, has had to shutter due to something like this. I said: Well, you could always stay open and get a ticket. To which she responded: "We don't want to do that, because it's not appropriate -- and it might make it harder to get that SUP."

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41 comments
Grumpy Demo
Grumpy Demo

Don't know which is more sad? Libertopians or people who don't understand basic municipal zoning?

Property zoning, been around since the Roman Empire, not a "Freebirty" issue.

nipper
nipper

kol nidre? you're a fuckin' idiot..

Travis Rex
Travis Rex

 Just when you thought it couldn't get any more ridiculous...

Horsefeathers
Horsefeathers

I know a good real estate agent, Bruce & Avi. I think you need to sell and maybe try some ranching in East Texas......Anger Management therapy might work & reconnecting with your wives would do wonders.......

Stacy
Stacy

seriously? Dallas is now making gas stations and convenience stores on lower Greenville get a special permit??.....Dallas KILLED Deep Ellum....is now  pouring millions into revitalizing it "which to this day 10 yrs later is still 90% empty"and now very soon we're gonna have to to the same thing w/ lower Greenville...ahh.....stop it Dallas ur making me ashamed to call you my home.

Restaurantqualityblender
Restaurantqualityblender

Good to hear that some of the businesses are standing up against Hunt and Co.'s thuggery in the guise of "progressiveness" and "forward thinking." I hope 7-11 sues the city's pants off.

Bpl7
Bpl7

Angela Hunt your hero .drink it up

Outtahere
Outtahere

And you people wonder why so many of us moved out of Dallas....

BCulbreath
BCulbreath

Why would a 24 hour business need an SUP to stay open its normal work schedule?They are a come ,and go business.Look at lost tax revenue,with a broke City, how can any one shut down a business that pays tax and employ people plus serve community.

Guest
Guest

It's truly going to be a ghost town...how sad. 

ts
ts

Why do the residents of lower Greenville hate the home of the free and the land of convenience?

Jefferson wept.

Burning Horsefeathers
Burning Horsefeathers

As one of the neighbors in the area for nearly 25 years, I have to laugh when I see comments like this. I have not been 'in the thick of things' like Bruce or Avi, but I do agree with them about 90% of the time.

So Mr. Horsefeather - Tell me why I should sell my house and leave Dallas? Is it because we are screwing up your so-called entertainment district, denying you the chance to use GHB or roofies on some pretty blonde girl, or maybe you really enjoy pissing on my car's tire while walking three blocks to your car (the only free space for blocks around here)?

If you have a realy good solid answer to my question, I am dying to hear it. If you just don't like adults telling you what to do when you are out in public, then please sit down, shut up and stop telling what to do with my property and neighborhood. You don't live here and your opinion does not matter spit.

Montemalone
Montemalone

Speaking of real estate, it won't be long til residential tax rates have to go up to offset the losses from business taxes and sales taxes. I wonder how that will affect the home prices in the area?

Josh van Hulst
Josh van Hulst

You totally said it. Greenville Ave has and always was a fun place to go from bar-to-bar. Like in Austin, TX you have the strip of bars to walk to. This law is stupid and makes Dallas exteremly boring! What are we suppose to do when you have night life like in Florida, Nevada???

Travis Rex
Travis Rex

 Everything Pork Pie wanted and then some!

jason
jason

I'm sorry.  You must be new around here.  The neighbors at this part of lower Greenville don't allow you to have feelings about their neighborhood.  The only thing you are allowed to have feelings about are the rules of the SUP process and the city's feelings about certain businesses (it's a subjective process where "luck" is somehow involved).  And, while discussing this part of Greenville, you will be reminded that it is not an Entertainment District, as there is "no such thing as an Entertainment District".  Also, since you mentioned Deep Ellum, you will notice some similarities between Deep Ellum and Lower Greenville: A business killing SUP process, a business killing roads project (the DART construction in Deep Ellum and whatever construction is happening on lower Greenville), and a not so sympathetic neighborhood.  

Chris Danger
Chris Danger

Its why im moving to the "outlying areas" in the next year, at least the suburbs seem to understand to let a 24 hr business be...

Robert Wilonsky
Robert Wilonsky

I know how to find it. It just hasn't been posted, far as I can tell.

Avi S. Adelman
Avi S. Adelman

Don't blame the residents for 7-Eleven's failure to keep up with the changes. Hmmm, maybe we need to find out if their property owner even told them what was happening??

George
George

hatersgonnahate.gif

nipper
nipper

i'll do as i please, bob. why don't YOU try leaving? it's not as if anyone besides danny wants you here. o.k. then? buh-bye...

jason
jason

And, while you might not agree with Horsefeathers comment, their opinion does count.  You forget that you live in an area that takes customers.  It has been stated time and time again by neighbors in the area that they should not be forced to support a local business if they don't want to.  Obviously, those businesses rely on people who do live there and the ones who don't live there, as you say.  Go ask one of the good bars.  Go ask Taco Cabana.  See if they agree with you.  See if they rely on business to come from people who don't live there.  

See, this is the problem with the neighbors.  They do not understand business, local government and blighted neighborhoods.  You all are simply not smart people.  

I have asked this time and time again from people who live in that neighborhood.  If you do not want the bars and clubs that are there, WHAT DO YOU WANT TO SEE IN THAT STIP OF LAND?????

jason
jason

Okay.  Let me get this straight.  You say, "I have not been 'in the thick of things' like Bruce or Avi, but I do agree with them about 90% of the time."  Horsefeathers was addressing his/her comment to "Bruce & Avi".  Then, you reply, "Tell me why I should sell my house and leave Dallas?"  Either you are Bruce or Avi, or you need to brush up on your reading comprehension.  Horsefeathers wasn't addressing you, unless you are Bruce or Avi.  

Which is it?  Three choices:  1.) Bruce or Avi?  2.) Reading comprehension?  3.) Other, please explain.

I really think you're Avi.  Your writing style matches "his" (wink). 

I am "dying to hear" how you know horsefeathers uses GHB or roofies on "some blonde girl".  Project much?

The problem with your 25 years of living there is that even 25 years ago (1986) that was an entertainment district then.  Bars/Clubs.  Record store.  Punk clothing store.  Arcadia.  Whole Foods Market.  A Pawn Shop.  Sounds like you either moved there not knowing what you were getting into or you moved there to be a part of that neighborhood.  Which is it?  Again, three options:  1.) Bad choice?  2.) Wanted to be part of that neighborhood? 3.) other, please explain.

I mean, wasn't the real estate market pretty strong during the worst days of Lower Greenville?  Why didn't you sell then?  During the worst days of Lower Greenville, which I think we can all agree were 5+ years ago, people would have killed to buy properties there and build McMansions.  Really, why did you stick around?  In my opinion, I think old age and stubbornness had set in and you were trying to pull a "Not In My Backyard" type of thing.  You moved into an Entertainment District (notice I didn't use quotation marks), got dissatisfied and wanted to stick it out - be damned them yung'ens.  Now, if you were sincere about not being in the thick of things, then you weren't helping out your neighborhood either.  You relied on "Bruce & Avi" to do your bidding. 

Face it.  All of you moved down there because of the neighborhood or you were all just too ignorant to know where you were moving.  It was an Entertainment District.  Get over it.  I just don't know who you all are trying to fool by stating how long you've lived there like that makes a difference.  I can give you examples of the bars/clubs that existed then.  It was only when people of a different color and a different lifestyle started coming down there did you all start the clampdown.  You weren't the instrument but you were the muscles pushing the instrument.  You are wrong.  Angela Hunt is wrong.  Bar/Club owners who skirt the law are wrong.  In politics, politicians wish they could get a do-over.  If you are smart you would be wishing for a do-over right now.  This scatter shot SUP process will ultimately kill your neighborhood.  You will wish you had better mouth pieces for your Neighborhood Association and a better councilperson.  

jfpo
jfpo

Don't go to Frisco, where their version of "bars" must close at midnight, period.

ChrisU
ChrisU

but do they hand out sup's to phony restaurants. doubtful Allen has a strip similar to Lower Greenville.

J. Erik Jonsson
J. Erik Jonsson

Of course you do.  Odd, though, I thought they were supposed to be scanning these suckers ASAP now.  I wonder if Jordan signed this late in the day.

nipper
nipper

hmmm... and YOU are a fuckin' idiot...

Wylie H.
Wylie H.

7-11 probably got confused... thought they were in a political jurisdiction where property rights were respected and legitimate businesses could operate free from arbitrary confiscation of their property via ex post facto imposition of restrictive regulations that effectively drive the existing property owners out of business.

As the City has made VERY clear lately (via Mary Nix), it holds large business enterprises in contempt (at least large business enterprises that don't employ semi-corrupt "facilitators"). Witness one of their primary arguments for turning McCommas into a monopoly dump: it will harm Waste Management and a couple of other big waste management companies--- for some perverse reason, the City thinks this (i.e. taking a shot across the bow of a legitimate company, just minding its own business) is something that will make the proposal more appealing to the average resident.

Chris Danger
Chris Danger

Heres hoping 7-11 Corp. sues the city for lost revenue on that store, thats a BS situation and EVERYONE knows it...What you reap is what your sew....

Travis Rex
Travis Rex

 They want small town in the big city..

Paul
Paul

Jason, this is about businesses conforming to the zoning requirements.  Nothing more, nothing less.

Prior to the PDZ this area was (and is) zoned Community Retail and MO-2.  It is surrounded by residential zoned R-7.5 and MF-2.

A city cannot zone solely on whether or not alcohol can be sold.  This is the sole purview of the TABC as to whether or not a beer and wine or a liquor by the drink license can be issued to a business.

The city can place general restrictions on whether or not zoning permits the sale of beer and wine or liquor by the drink.  These restrictions can include items such as Restaurant with out Drive In (Drive through) Service.  That is, you cannot drive up to a window and purchase a beer, wine or mixed drink and then drive off.  Also the city can impose limits on what percentage of the sale may be alcohol based, usually 75% max.

You cannot obtain a beer and wine, or, liquor license in an area zoned R-7.5 or MF-2.  You can obtain a beer and wine, or, liquor license in an area zoned Community Retail.

In Dallas, to be able to have more than 75% of your sales from alcohol, you are defined as a bar and your are required to have a SUP, regardless of what the zoning is in the area.  This also correlates directly to the TABC requirements which may require a public hearing prior to granting the alcoholic beverage license if the license application is protested (See Hooter's in Grand Prairie; or, Rick's Cabaret in Ft Worth on the south side of DFW airport).

For some reason the City found out that it cannot audit the alcohol sales to determine whether or not the businesses are in compliance with their CO.

In the P&Z for Dallas, there is no such thing as an "Entertainment District".  I believe that this has become a codeword for "bar" in order to avoid holding public hearings for the SUP for issuing the CO to a bar.

The only group that recognizes what these places are for what they are is the DPD.  No off duty DPD may work as security at one of these businesses as DPD has determined that their apparent primary purpose is to serve alcohol, which in DPD's eyes makes them a bar.

As for 7-11 not applying for their SUP, I have no idea as to why they haven't pursued it.

hth

Horsefeathers
Horsefeathers

Too ignorant to know where you were moving?  Huuummm.....I simply stated that if the opposition did not approve of the neighborhood, they might try some East Texas ranching. Not sure what might be available for piccolo players, webmasters and such but it would be a great opportunity to get a life and maybe find a real job......

Wylie H.
Wylie H.

Come on, this is Dallas County... do you REALLY think things down at the County Courthouse run on anything approaching a "best practices" standard?

Robert Wilonsky
Robert Wilonsky

Actual complaints are often posted days after the suits show up on the county site. DAYS. Very frustrating. The opposite of how the feds handle it on PACER.

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